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Mandi
19 Posts |
 Posted - 10/06/2007 : 09:18:07
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Is this a combination possibility that would speed the course of treatment??
If so, how do I mix it?
Also - will it make my skin look any worse than the 'usual' treatment?
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dan
611 Posts |
Posted - 10/07/2007 : 15:23:52
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| Yes, combining Carac (fluorouracil) and DMSO may possibly reduce the number of treatments needed and improve the reach of the treatments according to one skin cancer experimenters' report at http://www.topicalinfo.org/Topical.htm#efudex That experimenter mixed one part by volume of 5% Efudex cream into four parts by volume of 99.7% DMSO. Since Carac Cream contains 0.5% fluorouracil and Efudex contains 5% fluorouracil (10 times as much), the proportion of DMSO may need to be reduced if using with Carac. |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/08/2007 : 12:46:48
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| Will it make it more unsightly, sooner? |
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dan
611 Posts |
Posted - 10/09/2007 : 00:28:25
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| Mandi, it's not likely that anyone can offer good guidance on the Carac DMSO combination, just guesses. I think the premise is that the combination of DMSO and fluorouracil is more toxic to cancer cells than fluorouracil alone, or perhaps more toxic to an underlying fungus infection. So it may react stronger, and on a sensitive area like the lips, this may be a painful choice (or not). I would try Curaderm or Sunspot ES or an eggplant & vinegar remedy first. |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/09/2007 : 16:45:38
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I tried the eggplant/vinegar for a few days. Sadly, my lips are almost always raw from the layers that are constantly peeling off and it BURNED like crazy.
Strangely though...vinegar mixed with water doesn't burn. I often use this to rinse my hair (followed by a thorough rinse with plain water) to remove extra product build up due to my water being too soft. When I do this, it makes my lips peel less and look better (usually only lasts for a day, but I only do the rinse on my hair once a week).
I'm hesitant to start the Carac due to the rawness of my lips. I think its actually a contraindication. |
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dan
611 Posts |
Posted - 10/09/2007 : 23:55:54
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There's a couple things I found that may be helpful.
The first is a link to a May 2007 abstract "Management of actinic cheilitis using diclofenac 3% gel: a report of six cases" at http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=17488406 According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diclofenac , Diclofenac (marketed as Voltaren, Voltarol, Diclon, Dicloflex Difen, Difene, Cataflam, Pennsaid, Rhumalgan, Modifenac, Abitren, Arthrotec and Zolterol, with various drug dose combinations) is a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug (NSAID) taken to reduce inflammation and an analgesic reducing pain in conditions such as in arthritis or acute injury. It can also be used to reduce menstrual pain, dysmenorrhea.
Along similar lines, a topical ibuprofen gel can be made by puncturing a liquid Advil soft gel and combining it with a skin cream or perhaps coconut oil. This stops cancers by disrupting the COX-2 enzyme needed for growth.
There is a remedy described at http://www.topicalinfo.org/Topical.htm#coconut that combines coconut oil, melatonin, EGCG from green tea, and perhaps vitamin D. I used it for a while and it seemed to help in a mild fashion.
Finally, there is an inexpensive herbal product called New Chapter Zyflamend Liquid that inhibits the COX-2 enzyme, reduces inflammation, and promotes normal cell growth that I would consider applying topically. See http://www.vitacost.com/New-Chapter-Zyflamend-Liquid
"Contains Herbal Anti-Aging Constituents that Inactivate Free-radicals New Chapter has extensively researched the herbal pharmacopoeia and international medical databases and discovered that the following time-tested herbs, properly extracted and blended in the correct proportions, contain at least 8 phytonutrients that may safely and significantly inhibit COX-2.
* Holy Basil(Ocimum sanctum): Contains the powerful COX-2 inhibitor ursolic acid, which significantly enhances detoxification and reduces inflammation
* Turmeric: Unique curcumin phytonutrient complex, naturally inhibits inflammatory COX-2; synergistic with green tea, significantly multiplying anti-inflammatory effect of green tea polyphenols
* Ginger: Supercritical extract inhibits both inflammatory COX-2 and 5-LO and offers numerous anti-aging constituents
* Green Tea: Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences report green tea polyphenols markedly reduce COX-2. Major university database notes green tea contains 51 anti-inflammatory phytonutrients
* Rosemary: Dual extracts offer highly concentrated, full spectrum COX-2 inhibition and support detoxification
* Hu Zhang (Polygonum cuspidatum): richest known resveratrol source, shown scientifically to inhibit inflammatory COX-2
* Chinese Goldthread & Barberry: Unique berberine phytonutrient complex, naturally inhibits inflammatory COX-2
* Oregeno: Source of large number of anti-inflammatory compounds (31) according to USDA database
* Scutellaria: Unique baicalin phytonutrient complex, naturally inhibits inflammatory COX-2"
http://www.raysahelian.com/zyflamend.html has links to the individual ingredients in Zyflamend as well as research updates showing it is effective against some cancers by regulating cancer pathways NF-kappa B and the COX-2 enzyme. How to apply Zyflamend topically is a big unknown, but I would certainly dilute it to start.
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/10/2007 : 22:57:50
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Thanks so much for the information Dan. I am going to check into those.
I applied the Carac for the first time tonight. I can see this is going to be a real PIA. See...I work all day and ride horses until Dark (or later) when I get home. After that, I shower, then eat. Tonight I applied the Carac after I showered. While I was cooking, I assumed it would soak in and dry up. I tried to take a drink of water (haven't bought straws yet) and I could taste it (which I know can be bad since my derm told me not to get it in the inside of my lips). Anyhow...I survived that and eating (I was very careful) but ANYTIME I put something on my lips (chapstick, vaseline, lotion, etc) it seems to only moisturize the skin enough that the peeling layers just peel off easier. Same thing happened after applying the Carac. I assume it also soaked in, but for the most part, as usual, the top layers are peeling so I don't know how effective this will be. I also think that on days when my lips are more raw (some days are worse than others) the Carac could be quite a bit more painful.
Ugh!!! This really sucks!!! |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2007 : 09:08:56
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Ok. I mixed the Carac and DMSO. I didn't reduce the amount of DMSO. The whole reason my dermatologist chose the Carac was because it is weaker so we will see how this works out. I'll try it a few days and see if anything looks different.
I did the three applications 10 minutes apart then waiting 10 more minutes and washed it off.
My lips were white like when I previously used the eggplant/vinegar as a poultice for 20 minutes. After about 20 minutes, they returned to normal (as normal as they get). It burned for just a minute or two after each application in the areas that are more raw. Other than that, no problems. No additional peeling noted this morning (not any less either). I applied vaseline about 30 minutes after I rinsed them just to relieve some of the dryness.
I didn't even get the garlic taste in my mouth from having the DMSO on my skin. Strange??
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dan
611 Posts |
Posted - 10/13/2007 : 21:50:38
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| Mandi, thanks for the update and especially the details. It would be great if this works. |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/14/2007 : 15:11:35
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| I applied the combination again last night. Again, I did 3 treatments of 10 minutes each then 10 minutes later I washed it all off (with plain water). About 30 minutes later I applied vaseline just to help with the dryness. So far, my lips look and feel better than they have in a long time. I don't know if this is normal or not, but for now, it is exciting. I will continue to update daily. |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/18/2007 : 23:43:36
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Ok. I repeated the DMSO/Carac treatment for 5 days. Each day, starting about 30 minutes after the final application, there would be peeling, but it was painless and I strongly feel it was just the layers of the med peeling off.
The final treatment, I became a little distracted while doing and I was careless in my application. I didn't keep my lip 'puffed' out (and I tried to talk) so I accidentally got a little on the inside of my lower lip. That did cause it to peel just a tiny bit (with resulting blood) but I knew it was going to happen as my derm had already warned me that getting the carac in my mouth was BAD.
Yesterday was the first day I didn't do the treatment. My lips were still peeling some today, but again, I think it was old layers of either dead skin or medication. No pain, no bleeding, no thick scaly areas.
So far, so good. I am hopefully that this has resolved my problem.
I also noticed, about a week ago, a spot on each ear. Unsure if I just 'coincidentally' got my first mosquito bites EVER on my ears or if these also happen to be sun damage/cancer or something. They weren't healing on their own after about 10 days. I applied the Carac/DMSO to them each once and though the 'tingling' sensation that the mixture causes was almost unbearable on the sensitive skin of my ears, they seemed to start healing almost immediately. They aren't gone yet, but I haven't applied anymore. They are almost gone. |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 10/20/2007 : 13:45:49
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| Well...I've continued to have peeling and today it was even starting to look "almost" like it used to. I was really hoping the DMSO/Carac was a shortcut to a faster treatment. I'm going to keep moisturizing and see what happens. |
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dan
611 Posts |
Posted - 10/21/2007 : 00:39:53
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| Mandi, thanks for the update. I think I understand, you applied Carac and DMSO for 5 days and then took 3 days off so far, and you have not seen enough progress yet to be very optimistic that you won't need more treatments? |
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Mandi
19 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2009 : 15:18:40
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I ended up giving up on the Carac & DMSO. It wasn't doing anything for me.
I tried two weeks of Carac - again, no improvement after the initial "trauma" healed.
Tried Efudex and DMSO for a few days, but I got sick (stomach bug) and had to stop all treatments.
Ended up doing straight Efudex 4 1/2 weeks. It temporarily healed the problem, though some flakeyness remained. Results lasted less than 3 months and now I'm back to where I started...but more frustrated. I think I'm going to try the Efudex & DMSO again AND start looking for a dermatologist who will consider laser or surgical treatment. I'm going to be 27 in two weeks and I don't want to deal with this for the rest of my life. |
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RidgebackDogs
USA
103 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2009 : 21:22:53
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Hi Mandi!
check out this link for some other ideas on what to do - perhaps you can use the search function at the top of the page too i tried actinic chelitis but only got two hits the one i am pasting below and another one with nothing interesting. maybe a search on the word lips would be better.
http://www.topicalinfo.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=200
i too don't like dealing with this mess!!!
Hang in there girl! i'll be praying for you!
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anivoc
668 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2009 : 11:08:38
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Hi Mandi,
Did you try this... posted elsewhere on this site.. it is supposed to be "THE" solution.
A person and his associates who have been calling themselves the Angular Chelitis (spelled incorrectly intentionally) Foundation have been selling a little ebook on how to solve this problem. I bought this book some time ago and it wiped out my mouth sores very fast after suffering for 2 months. So I thought the money I paid was worth it and so out of gratitude I haven't revealed the info in any discussion groups. However, they've been selling this home remedy for about five years now and I think that's enough time to make their money. So in my own words, with some modifications, I'm going to reveal the solution here. (This is the internet so it had to come out sooner or later.)
You'll need *concentrated* dish washing soap (i.e., Palmolive), a new jar of white petroleum jelly (such as Vaseline), and paper towels. You'll also need two washing bowels. I bought some plastic ones from Safeway.
1. Floss and brush your teeth. Clean out your mouth.
2. Disinfect your hands especially under your finger nails with the soap.
3. Disinfect your wash area, whether it's your kitchen or your bathroom counter. You could use a disinfectant cleaner or the soap you bought.
4. Disinfect your wash bowels with the soap and then fill both of them with *warm* water.
5. Get a small clean plate and pour a little soap on it and put it next to one of the wash bowels.
6. Disinfect your hands again (see above).
7. Go to the first wash bowel and wipe some water over your lips, especially the cuts for a few seconds.
8. Take the soap from the plate and gently rub the soap into the cuts and around the mouth for about a minute. Close your mouth tight because soap obviously shouldn't get inside your mouth. You shouldn't swallow soap. If it gets in your mouth, no problem, just rinse your mouth and begin anew.
9. Go to the second bowel and clean the soap off.
10. Take the paper towels and dry your mouth. Every time you dab your mouth, use one towel at a time. BTW, if you have to rinse your mouth, go ahead.
11. Let your sores dry (five/ten minutes or longer). A little warning, when you look in the mirror, your sores are going to be red and wide open so it's not going to look too pretty. Don't worry about this for now.
12. Take the unused jar of white petroleum jelly and and wipe it around on the cuts and around your lips, under the nose, and on your chin. Although white petroleum jelly wasn't made to be eaten, it's okay if it gets in your mouth and tiny bit gets swallowed. Remember petroleum is already a major ingredient in lip protectors such as Vaseline Lip Therapy.
13. Two hours later, wipe off the jelly with paper towels. *Wash the jelly off by using the steps above.*
14. Let dry for 10 to 20 minutes and see if the sores shrink. If they do, you're on the road to recovery. By the time you wake up next morning, the inflammation should be down as the normal healing process will take over. **If your sores haven't shrunk, reapply the jelly and wait an hour or two and remove it again.**
Explanations. The formulator of this remedy (his son had Angular Cheilitis for 3 years) found out through his research in medical journals that fungal bacterias cannot live in dry conditions. It needs moisture to survive. (This is true, I myself checked abstracts through Google Scholar.) The soap kills and dries the infection in the wound. The jelly, a water repellent, which is placed over the dry wound, traps the bacteria in dry prison thus extinguishing it.
The originator of this home remedy suggests for hard luck cases, you may need to this multiple times such as once a day for a few days or four times in one day. Work what's best for you.
For myself, scar tissue/new skin started to form over my wounds which lasted a week. I continued to be careful how I ate your food. I cut my food into little pieces, avoided acid-like foods such as tomatoes and oranges, consumed smoothies with a straw.
If this works for you, forward this information to anyone who needs help.
EDIT: One person who tried this said that although the treatment did rid her infection, new skin inside the lesion was slow to form. So she used 1% hydrocortisone cream and everything was healed in three days -- even though the cream was useless when she first used it to treat her cuts. However, I suspect it's a matter of timing. Hydrocortisone cream increases blood circulation in the skin to help heal the wound (less blood flow prevents healing). But the cream isn't what you need when the infection is the main problem. Eliminate the infection first then use hydrocortisone. Note: don't use hydrocortisone cream on open cuts. Let some skin tissue form over it first.
SECOND EDITS: I think it was a mistake to mention that after the treatment I didn't apply ointment or lubricant to my lips. (I've deleted this remark.) A person who wrote me said his lips became cracked when he did this. Actually it's probably best to regularly clean (especially after each meal) the cuts with water and hydrogen peroxide and then apply Neosporin to the cuts. Use pure petroleum jelly (you can also buy them in small tubes instead of a jar) for the rest of the lips. When the cuts are healed, apply to entire lip with the jelly for about a month because drying out the mouth could rip open the cuts again.
Another person who wrote me said he went further and actually applied Band Aids to his cuts when he was sleeping. He said this accelerated the healing. I would suggest being careful about how long in leaving the band aid on your face because the adhesive could leave a rash. I would suggest using the "Sheer" Band Aids. |
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Carac and DMSO
